Run-on obsession?

[SpikeWyatt]

I edit articles for a friend as well as writing my own, though I haven't submitted for a while (slacking, slapped wrists!). Just recently, he's been getting TONS of "run-on sentence" rejections. In every case, it's a sentence with a conjunction (usually "and"), such as "Independent freelancers bid and each job is awarded to the winning bidder."

I see nothing wrong with that sentence. It has two parts which could stand independently but which are joined together by a conjunction because they are related. One follows the other. If the "and" were not present, it would be a run-on sentence.

Then, when he resubmits with the same comment, he is told that he needs a comma before the conjunction. Well yes it's "normal" to do that (less so in the UK, but I won't get into that argument here), but not in a short sentence like that one.

Is it just me, or is a new editor getting a bit obsessive (and incorrect) about run-on sentences?

[Lysis]

I get the opposite mostly. I get "remove the comma" rejections.

I'm trying to figure it out myself, because I thought there was always a comma if the second part makes up a complete sentence, but from what I can see, it seems like if the second part is short then it doesn't need one? I'm not sure, but I did have to comment just because I get the exact opposite all the time. lol

ETA: I would add a comma in your example sentence, because the second part is a complete sentence. But it could also be editor preference in this case.

[SpikeWyatt]

As I understand it (and after checking with a couple of reliable sites), it's normal to put a comma in if the second part is a complete sentence, yes. But in a short sentence it looks untidy and chops things up too small, so it becomes a style question - you can put it in or leave it out, as far as I can tell.

Mostly, it surprises me because I've never been pulled up on it before and suddenly it's happening all the time.

[Isabelnewth]

Editorial standards aren't completely consistent, and it's particularly annoying when rules that one doesn't acknowledge are not only applied but misapplied with ferocious rigour. That's the sort of sentence that would definitely get me an 'awkward construction/sounds like English is not your first language' comment. Probably fair enough.

Happy holidays to freelancers far and wide, anyway, and a prosperous new year!

[MKatz]

if the part after the "and" has a subject, you should put in a comma. I know that's what that TB expects (if I can mention that) to maintain a level 4 or 5.

I'm nobody's gift to complex grammar, but I'm pretty sure this is what the editors are looking for:

I went to the store and bought dog food. (NO)
I went to the store, and I bought dog food. (YES)
I went to the store;I bought dog food. (Drama )

If the comma bothers you, leave off the second subject. If the lack of a comma bothers you, put the subject in. That was what an editor in another place told me, and the advice has seemed to serve me well.

[SpikeWyatt]

I went to the store, and I bought dog food. (YES)

This looks incredibly ugly to me. I can see the need in complex or long sentences, but I really don't see the point in being pedantic about a rule that isn't a hard-and-fast rule. I mean, if it were an actual run-on sentence, I'd understand... but it isn't.

I suppose I got the feeling they were trying to spot something wrong, even if it was just a question of style. I've run into that with comma usage as well, where an article gets rejected, I say it's fine (and explain why) and it goes through without question on the resubmit, even with no changes.

As we all know, editing is subjective: I just wondered whether anyone else had experienced the run of run-ons as my friend has.

[Word Gypsy]

If you go to the extended writer guidelines and scroll down to "Commas" in the "Grammar" section, you will note that CC refers you to review http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/607/01/ in which it clearly states that you should "1. Use commas to separate independent clauses when they are joined by any of these seven coordinating conjunctions: and, but, for, or, nor, so, yet." It's really not all that subjective when it is stated so clearly in the guidelines. Anyone receiving repeated rejections might do well to review all of the guidelines as a refresher. Even if you think you have good writing skills, you still need to follow CC's preferred rules, whether or not you agree with them. Happy writing!

[Isabelnewth]

It's true of course that we have to follow the set of rules given. I don't agree that they represent a standard of objective 'correctness', but there you go.

It's true too that different editors seem to apply the standards slightly differently, and some have particular bugbears. I'm not sure how assignment of articles to different editors works, but it doesn't seem that you stay with the same one for ever!

[topquark]

I find that if you write for requests, particularly if you submit near the deadline, then the nit picking goes away completely. I've had articles accepted with all kinds of typos that I've only noticed later.

If you're submitting to the general catalogue, it seems totally random whether or not something will be sent back. In my experience, if you change the sentence in question, it will be accepted, even if what you're changing it to is technically "wrong".

[SpikeWyatt]

If you go to the extended writer guidelines and scroll down to "Commas" in the "Grammar" section, you will note that CC refers you to review http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/607/01/ in which it clearly states...

Thanks for that. It's understandably hard to retain ALL the specific writing rules in my tiny little head all the time, so the reference helps a lot. As you say, whether it's right or wrong, it's CC's standard and, ergo, must be followed.

In my experience, if you change the sentence in question, it will be accepted, even if what you're changing it to is technically "wrong".

Not guilty of this at all. Nope. Not at all. Never. Honest...

[Word Gypsy]

It is a lot to remember, and a refresher never hurts, especially since so many variations exist. Have a Happy New Year!

[Lisa-Anne Sanderson]

Hello Topquark,

I've also received rejections for articles submitted for Private Requests! It's extremely discouraging, because I really don't want to have
to resubmit articles for customers too many times!

My acceptance rate has gone up and down a lot over the years.