Quotation Marks - WSJ

[Ed]

I have been going through one of those phases. Letters keep dropping from the ends of words, or I'll mean one word but my fingers type another, more common word. It is because I am turning into an editing monster. Let's hope just for Halloween.

[Celeste Stewart]

I know the feeling. Lately, when I want to type "b," I actually type "p." The same goes for "g" and "q" and I sometimes get ahead of myself and mix up letters within words. Maybe I'm coming down with a belated case of dyslexia. . .

[Ed]

Maybe there's something in the air. I had a similar thought this morning.

[Celeste Stewart]

I think we're both working too hard. Or in my case today, not hard enough. Okay, off the forum and back to writing I go, b's, p's, q's, g's and all.

[BarryDavidson]

I keep hitting the semicolon instead of the apostrophe. I also have a tendency to type the beginning of one work, but my mind is three words ahead, so I'll type the end of that word.

I guess it doesn't help matters that I'm a "pecker". I'm old school enough to only use a few fingers when typing.

[HayleyWriter]

Barry,
You have misunderstood my intention. Had you read my entire comment on the constructive criticism thread, you would have realised that I actually was advocating the use of commas, when used correctly. I do not buy into the argument that we do not need proper punctuation. I believe we do and I will continue to have a mix of sentences within my own writing, as Ed has so eloquently stated within this forum thread. In the case of the discussion on the constructive criticism thread, I thought there were many clauses within the one sentence, using unnnecessary words, and it was not as clear as it could have been. My comment about reducing the commas was really about reducing the unnecessary clauses and making the writing clear. I was making suggestions for clarity, not being a comma nazi.

Hayley

[BarryDavidson]

[quote="HayleyWriter"]Barry,
You have misunderstood my intention. Had you read my entire comment on the constructive criticism thread, you would have realised that I actually was advocating the use of commas, when used correctly. I do not buy into the argument that we do not need proper punctuation. I believe we do and I will continue to have a mix of sentences within my own writing, as Ed has so eloquently stated within this forum thread. In the case of the discussion on the constructive criticism thread, I thought there were many clauses within the one sentence, using unnecessary words, and it was not as clear as it could have been. My comment about reducing the commas was really about reducing the unnecessary clauses and making the writing clear. I was making suggestions for clarity, not being a comma nazi.

Hayley[/quote]

I wasn't accusing. Sorry if I misunderstood... I've seen a thousand comments like that, and automatically assumed. I need to get out of fiction writing mode, and slip into article writing mode. I did read the entire comment. I only quoted that small amount to keep from sounding like I was attacking you. Oops...

I'll try to do better in the future.

Honestly though, I've seen editors with twenty-plus years of experience get attacked for their comma usage when posting their own work for feedback. It must be the difference between writing articles, and writing short stories or books. People really get hammered these days for long sentences, even when the clarity is there.

As someone was saying elsewhere, most online publishers are looking for material which people with a 6th grade education can easily understand. Books are like that almost across the board now.

[Ed]

[Aside]Which is one reason why a person can't just go into a bookstore anymore and easily find something to read. Anyway, I can't get beyond the idiotic titles half the time.

[Lor]

That book thingy

I agree. I have a few authors I read and if I stray I regret it. Books aren't cheap. Reviews are important to me now.

I read mainly historical fiction. One of my favorites was Pillars of the Earth, by Ken Follet -- traditionally a thriller author. When he wrote the next book in this genre, it was a mess. Didn't have the same urgency. Characters were a disappointment. I feel, sometimes, that publishers and editors already know it will be a bestseller and don't spend enough time with the writer to make it worthy. It's not about great literature anymore. I have a lot to say about this, but I'd be here too long and the cat wants to take me for a walk. Just my two cents.

Lor

[BarryDavidson]

[quote="Lor"]It's not about great literature anymore. I have a lot to say about this, but I'd be here too long and the cat wants to take me for a walk. Just my two cents.

Lor[/quote]

I could go on for days about this myself. Where I disagree is that I feel publishers and editors are spending too much time changing the work, trying to make it fit the "popular" formula, and not nearly enough letting the writer tell a great story.


I read one of Harry Turtledove's Books. I wanted to put it down after the first chapter, and only kept reading it because I'd gotten it for 2.00 in the bargain bin. (I was out of books at home that I hadn't read at least five time previously.)

[Lor]

<<...editors are spending too much time changing the work, trying to make it fit the "popular" formula...>>

That may be true with new authors, but once a writer's "in," a writer's "in." The books will sell regardless of reviews. The money's in the name.

:)
Lor

[Celeste Stewart]

Back to lack of quotation marks:
One area that I've noticed quotation marks not being used, and I think this particular usage is actually fairly practical, is with computer tutorials. For example, when writing instructional articles for software, it appears that the current style is to avoid quotes. For example:
Click the Start button and then go to the Control Panel icon. (Not: Click the "Start" button and then go to the "Control Panel" icon.)
Go to File and then choose Save As. (Not: Go to "File" and then choose "Save As.")

Oftentimes, the word in question is printed in bold. Also, many of the computer terms are proper nouns and should be capitalized (Safe Mode - not safe mode; System Restore - not system restore).

In my opinion, this particular "lack of quotes" usage works. Hmmn, I wonder if there's an official style guide for tutorials?

While I don't care for literary stylistic writing such as dropping the quotation marks for dialog or failing to capitalize words ala e.e. cummings, occassionally, it works. For example, good ol' Stephen King used an unusual reverse italics style for showing the thoughts of a character who I believe is a possessed doll trying to come to life (I don't know for sure because I'm only about 100 pages in) in his book "Duma Key." The text was so disjointed that it gave the segment a disorienting effect - and it worked; I liked it despite how hard it was to read. But of course, you've got to know the rules before you can break them effectively.

[Ed]

I agree that bold font is a better result than quotation marks around the names for keys or tasks in a tutorial. Too many quotation marks can be distracting to the point of hilarity. I once heard the story of an aerospace design professor who was quotation mark-crazy. So the "wings" of the "airplane" were shaped like the "wings" of "birds." While the original was much more technical, the quotation marks make the objects they surround seem surreal. An airplane, but not really an airplane - so an "airplane."

However, for anyone reading - the words in Celeste's example should be offset in some way to avoid impairment of clarity.